What do H&A fans think of Brazilian jiu jitsu?

[slideyfoot]

Heh, a Warwick Uni student. I'm thinking of applying there next year to study Chemistry.

I started as an English Lit BA student in 1999, and I'm still here as an English Lit PhD student, over a decade later. Its a great place to learn, although they do have a habit of being rather corporate. I get the impression they care more about conference guests than students sometimes.

There are a lot of places situated around where I live (I am between Leamington Spa & Stratford-Upon-Avon, which both have a lot of Martial Arts classes)

Heh - martial arts vary widely in quality and purpose. BJJ is one of the few that incorporates 'aliveness', meaning that training actually results in proven efficacy, as opposed to just compliant drilling. Far too many MA out there who will simply tell you something works, rather than actively showing you, by testing it against somebody fully resisting.

when I was looking up the name of an old WWE wrestler (who was brutal and not fake) to see what he is upto now (Ken Shamrock)... but that is off-topic.

Not entirely off-topic, as Ken Shamrock was a pivotal figure in the UFC, and to an extent for the rise of BJJ as well: his good looks, submission skills and charisma helped launch the UFC, and in turn that helped BJJ. Shamrock started out as a pro-wrestler in the States, later moving to Japan, where pro-wrestling is heavily influenced by the 'shoot' style of Karl Gotch. In other words, Japanese pro-wrestlers had legitimate submission skills, rather than just athletic ability and stage presence, which tends to be the case with their US counterparts. Shamrock found himself in one of the early Japanese pro-wrestling promotions that wanted to move from putting over old stars and instead showcasing their real abilities (though naturally there were still plenty of works).

That would become Pancrase, a mixed martial arts event that predates the UFC. Shamrock was a major player, and in the midst of his Japanese success, he took up the opportunity of fighting in the first UFC. Given his impressive physique and submission skills, he was expected by many to take the tournament. However, he underestimated Royce Gracie, and got caught in a choke. To this day he blames Royce's gi.

Shamrock was a decent submission wrestler, but he never really grabbed the chances he was given by the UFC. He never won a tournament, only super fights. UFC 3 was there for the taking, after Royce had to pull out due to hypoglycemia. Shamrock didn't want to continue, however, as his only reason for being there was to avenge that early loss against Royce. Same kind of thing kept happening. He eventually moved into the WWE, before coming back to the UFC to get beaten up by Tito Ortiz, several times.

His adopted brother (they were both taken in by Bob Shamrock, hence the surname), Frank Shamrock, was a very different story. One of the best fighters in MMA, though the UFC doesn't like to mention him, because he left the organisation. Dana White, the head of the UFC, frequently tries to rewrite history, which is why Frank Shamrock didn't get a mention in the recent '100 Greatest Fights' thing the UFC ran. Revisionism at its most blatant.

Looks as if Home and Away's research wasn't particularly brilliant for Brazillian Ju Jitsu. Though I suppose they didn't expect people to go online and check that their techniques were right

Heh - I'm a particularly obsessive BJJer.

But yeah, it is clear that the point of this particular storyline element is not to stay accurate to BJJ, something which becomes obvious in later glaring errors the writers make in their depiction (I'll get round to those in a little while). It would appear they just wanted a self defence class in which to plonk Elijah and Leah, which would fit into the anxiety plot, along with providing an opportunity for close bodily contact. I would be interested to know why they decided to call it Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, and if that decision is in any way indicative of BJJ's popularity. Could just be one of the writers liked the name, who knows.

[Emma_B]

I've not read all the posts in this thread. And I've not posted in this forum in well over 3 years. But I've been lurking on and off recently, and I've got to say that as a person three months away from being a Registered Nurse, who has friends who have been violently attacked and have suffered PTSD as a result, I vehemently dislike this storyline. I think if H&A wants to move towards "issues" storylines it has a responsibility to portray them in an appropriate way. As a general rule, one does not "get over" severe agoraphobia and panic attacks by going to a few self-defence classes. I find this story extremely reductionist, dismissive of the genuine daily suffering that people with PTSD and similar problems undergo, and actually extremely ableist (in that, like several of H&A's key storylines, it is discriminatory against those people within our society who live with mental illness).

I literally couldn't love H&A more, but that's not to say that on certain issues it doesn't need to be brought up to date, and this is without a doubt one of those. Essentially, I feel either don't touch on the issue, or tackle it properly. Do not waft about it in a dismissive and discriminatory way. It feels to me like the whole riot was brought to have this amazingly important serious storyline with Leah's PTSD, and for no other reason as far as we can see so far, but then they have made the storyline a sham. Like I said, ableist and irresponsible. I hope no one actually dealing with severe PTSD is inspired to join a self defence class without the support of a qualified therapist as a result of the storyline, as the results could be catastrophic.

[SerasV]

Wasn't Dustin Hoffman an exponent of this in Meet the Fokkers? I would definitely suggest Elijah teaches everyone in the bay as there are some dodgy types turn up from time to time:)

[slideyfoot]

Wasn't Dustin Hoffman an exponent of this in Meet the Fokkers? I would definitely suggest Elijah teaches everyone in the bay as there are some dodgy types turn up from time to time:)

I think that was capoeira, which is also Brazilian, but very different from Brazilian jiu jitsu. Capoeira is mainly flashy kicks, handstands, spinning, flips etc, whereas BJJ is grappling on the floor, so relies on joint locks and chokes.